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     Brenda O'Dell Junior Member Username: brendaodell Post Number: 20 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 75.105.188.106 Rating: N/A |
The doe is doing well. I gave her 5 days of penicillin because I assisted with the delivery. Her milk is normal consistency...but she suddenly develped bottle jaw. This is strange because she normally is a very healthy goat. I wormed her after she kidded. I checked her temp yesterday and it was 102.7. The twins are sucking and eating as much as I will give them. Thank you for all yoru help. Brenda | ||
| Elaine Elder New member Username: elaine Post Number: 81 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 68.215.178.9  Rating: N/A |
The only thing I can find in an internet search for milk being too thick is about dairy cows... ...The udder becomes hard and hot with an abnormal discharge. In the recently calved cow the milk is thick, creamy and smells foul. The cow is often lame in one or both hind legs with swollen joints. Body temperature can be high. If these symptoms fit - it may be mastitis. By increasing the frequency of milking to four times daily, mastitis may be reduced. Mastitis is usually controlled by antibiotics infused into the teat via a tube or syringe. I'm not sure on this diagnosis for your mother goat. Please check her temp. Please post temp and other symptoms here so someone can help you with her. Please post if she is OK. Elaine ee@andprinting.com | ||
| Alex Cripps New member Username: hazydaynubians Post Number: 99 Registered: 10-2006 Posted From: 142.167.13.188  Rating: N/A |
I just had a doe kid on Jan 28 and her milk has clumps in it it was just the first milk being a little thick. It has thined out now but still has a little in it. All i did was put it though a milk filter like i do with all my milk. And it is now great! Don't worry about it being thick Alex Cripps Hazy Day Nubians raising Nubians, Boers, Indian Runner Ducks www.hazydaynubians.piczo.com Apohaqui New Brunswick Canada | ||
| Barbara Howard Advanced Member Username: bhoward Post Number: 184 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 206.157.148.122 Rating: N/A |
Brenda please check the little buck for me feel the roof of the mouth tell me is it smooth or split. Do you have a temp on them? Barbara Howard Capri-Medic jamesa@mrtc.com 606-522-3388 KY | ||
| Brenda O'Dell Junior Member Username: brendaodell Post Number: 19 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 75.105.188.106 Rating: N/A |
I tube fed both kids yesterday. Last night the buckling walked over to me and drank out of a bottle - only 1 oz but it was a major breakthrough. The 2nd one sucked this morning. They both are peeing and pooping... The doeling is still very weak...she sounds so pathetic when she cries. They both had fluid in their lungs when they were born. I have them in the house today and will be able to give them more attention. Thanks, Brenda | ||
| Elaine Elder New member Username: elaine Post Number: 77 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 216.9.250.6 Rating: N/A |
Maybe if you keep milking, it will thin out. I am not expert on new moms. Keep checking here. Someone who knows more will log on with more help. I am on my blackberry. So I don't have a search engine til Monday. Elaine ee@andprinting.com | ||
| Brenda O'Dell Junior Member Username: brendaodell Post Number: 18 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 75.105.188.106 Rating: N/A |
Thank you for all of the information. It is very helpful. I put sweaters on the twins and took them in the house last night - to keep them warm as well as to make it easier on me to feed them. They still wouldn't take a bottle so I had a friend show me how to stomach tube them. They now have full bellies and are sleeping. I will tube them until I can get them to suck without it going into their nose ...I'm sure they will be fine when they get some nourishment and grow stronger. Don't think that the nanny will be able to nurse them...her colostrum is still the thickness of custard. He said in all the years that he's raised goats, he's never seen colostrum like this. Have you ever experienced that? Brenda | ||
| Elaine Elder New member Username: elaine Post Number: 75 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 72.152.150.141 Rating: N/A |
Woops... copied something twice at end, sorry. | ||
| Elaine Elder New member Username: elaine Post Number: 74 Registered: 12-2006 Posted From: 72.152.150.141 Rating: N/A |
http://www.goatwisdom.com/ch1baby_care/wimpykid.html Quotes from page: Warmth It is essential that the weak baby be kept warm. It simply does not have the energy reserves to maintain life AND body temperature. This can be done by any of the following: Heat lamps: By far, the largest single cause of barn fires is heat lamps falling into the bedding hay. If used, these should be secured with strong WIRE and not twine, the clamps that come with them or any other hurried creation. They should also be used in such a way as to provide a uniform temperature throughout the day and night, not just when the outside temperature is lowest. Remember that radiant heat does not warm the air, only objects which it strikes. The air which the baby breathes will still be cold. Any animal placed under a heat lamp should be checked frequently to make sure that it is not too warm. A wet animal should NEVER be placed under a heat lamp; take the time to make sure it is thoroughly dry. As the baby gets better, gradually raise the lamp rather than suddenly removing it. Warming the air: Whenever possible, and I realize that this is easier said than done, the air itself should be warmed to a reasonble temperature, depending on the condition of the baby. This will lead to greater expense and the danger of fire should always be considered. Jackets: Little baby jackets can easily be made out of old sweatshirts, sweaters, coats and the like. These are excellent ways to help preserve body heat. Make sure they are kept dry and clean, since a weak kid will not always be very selective in its toilet habits. Also, make sure that they are designed in such a way that they don’t strangle or hang the baby. Heating pads: Several suppliers offer (rather expensive) waterproof electric heating pads, mostly designed for canine use. Some of these are excellent and will provide a steady supply of regulated heat. The heating pads designed for people use can be placed in a box NEXT TO or OVER the patient, but NEVER under. Other devices such as heated artificial rocks for reptile cages can be used with care; more of these are coming onto the market all the time. Into the house: If you have ever visited a sheep farming family during lambing season, you’ll find any number of little boxes in the house each containing one or more little "bummer" lambs. There are several reasons which make this the best choice. The baby and the surrounding air can be kept at a uniform, comfortable temperature. The patient is readily available for feeding, cleaning and checking without having to make all those trips to the barn. And if you’re looking for a particularly good way to aggravate the wife, make sure you don’t participate in keeping the mess cleaned up. Under the covers: You won’t find this one in your fancy text books, but I’ve never failed to revive a dying baby when at the end of a long hard day of maternity care we both curl up under the electric blanket for a nice nap. It works pretty good too if you’re looking for an excuse for a divorce. Constipation This problem is extremely common in baby goats. Frequently, kids do not pass the myconeum the black, pasty first poop and will lose their appetites shortly after birth. This situation is usually mistaken for some other exotic ailment and incorrect treatment remedies only do more harm than good. The kid may lie on its side, kick randomly while standing or lying down, walk aimlessly and/or be nervous. It can easily be corrected by gentle enemas, digital stimulation (finger in anus, gently) or a warm, wet cloth passed over the anus. Use mineral oil and other laxatives with extreme caution in babies, since they can have some negative effects. Finally, be aware that it is faily common for diarrhea to follow the successful treatment of constipation. More on this can be found at Constipation How to get the kid to nurse off mom On just about every page it seems we have emphasized the importance of helping the baby learn to nurse as soon as possible after birth. Once the fluid has been cleared from the lungs, it is time to start the training. Should every attempt to get the kid to nurse off mom fail, milk 4 - 8 ounces of colostrum into a small "nipple bottle" and feed it directly to the kid without delay. Once a little has reached the taste buds in the mouth, the nursing instinct will be stimulated in almost every case. (More hints on bottle feeding will be offered below.) Before you try the kid on mom, milk out one or two squirts from each teat into a towel in order to guarantee that the "plug" has been removed and that milk is flowing freely. If nothing comes out, either she has no milk or you need to work further on the plug. Sometimes you will need to manipulate the plug out with gentle force by squeezing and sliding your thumb and forefinger down the teat. Never insert a foreign object into the teat to remove the plug. (The following technique may sound overly-acrobatic, but do it anyway--because I said so!) With the dam restrained, preferably by someone holding her, lie all the way on the ground on your side or back so that you are looking up at the mom's belly. With the kid held in a position so that it is about ready to nurse, squirt a drop or two of milk onto your finger. Put the milky finger into the kids mouth and try to get the kid to suck on your finger. If you succeed, it will make the next step easier; if you don't, then go to the next step anyhow. While holding the kid's mouth slightly open, use the other hand to squirt a small amount into the mouth. Try to aim the stream so that it hits against the tongue or some other part so that the milk has an opportunity to stimulate the taste buds and does not just run down the throat in such a way that it can get into the lungs. You are trying to get the kid to want the milk and go searching for it rather than just passively letting you pour it down the throat. This will do so much more to train it to nurse on its own. Usually it will start wiggling around trying to find out where this good-tasting stuff is coming from and your job is now simply one of helping it find the teat by moving the teat to the kid rather than trying to force the kid toward the teat. By lying completely on the ground, all your efforts can be directed toward this one task. Otherwise, you will find yourself standing on your head, off-balance, fighting with a reluctant kid who is trying to go backwards and, by now, a mom who is getting very impatient with your silliness. It may take several attempts before the kid learns how to grasp the teat, but if you reward it frequently with a little milk aimed into the mouth, you'll find that a few minutes spent in this ungraceful-looking position will save many minutes or even hours spent fighting with an unwilling partner. If you have to force the situation, use the index finger of one hand to hold the mouth open while inserting the teat into the mouth with the other hand. You will be more apt to be successful if you make a real mess of the job and start the stream BEFORE the teat gets into the mouth so that there is an opportunity to taste the milk before this strange object is jammed into its mouth. If failure continues, go back to the milk-on-the-finger step and get it sucking on your finger once again. The most important thing is to stimulate the sucking instinct; if this is present, the rest will follow. How to get the kid to take a bottle This is one of the hardest and most important things in all of goat raising. Several of the above techniques described above will help here as well. Try to convince the kid to suck on your milky finger. If you are feeding powdered milk, use any kind of whole milk (such as cow milk, condensed milk) to get it started. They don't usually like the taste of most powdered replacers. Make sure the nipple is rather soft, not a brand new hard one. Try putting just the very tip of the nipple in the mouth and squirting a small amount in ahead of it, making the kid reach for it a litte. You can try sliding the nipple in and out of the mouth a little. Sometimes kids will nurse better if you have your finger in its mouth along side of the nipple and wiggle it around a little bit. Some kids learn easier when sucking out of a small bowel or bucket. Stick your finger in the mouth and dip the mouth into the milk. The kid will get some in the nose, but that's OK. Have various family members try. Sometimes one (usually one of your children) seems to have good luck when others fail and for no obvious reason. If this is a kid which you purchased from someone else, try to acquire and use the same product which they were using and then gradually make the trasition to the type of milk that you will be using. It's a lot better for the milk to pour out the side of the kids mouth than to have it running down the throat into the lungs. [Without getting into a lot of technical details, it is important that the reticular groove reflex be stimulated by genuine sucking so that the milk doesn't end up in the wrong stomach, where it cannot be digested and will only cause further illness.] Oral electrolytes If the nursing instinct is intact but the intake of milk is inadequate to meet the needs of the baby (diarrhea, imbalances, malabsorption), an excellent choice is the use of oral electrolyte preparations. These usually come in packages of powder to which warm water is to be added. Most kids will take a while to adjust to the awful taste of these products, but do so eventually. While they do not contain a large number of nutrients, their use can sustain life for a few days while underlying causes are corrected. Their main purpose is to restore the electrolyte balance, which has usually been upset in kids which are critically ill. SQ (IV) electrolytes One of the best ways to increase the chance of survival in a weak newborn is to give electrolytes intraveneously or subcutaneously. The only mail order source which I am aware of is Pipestone Veterinary Supply who offer "5% Dextrose and Lactated Ringers," item #1631, page 43. (Some vets will sell you electrolytes intended for IV use.) The product should be warmed to room or near body temp and given at the rate of 40 ml per 10 pound of kid twice a day (per Pipestone). We would recommend that the average person stick to subcutaneous administration since IV use in a baby animal can be quite difficult as well as dangerous. We would also recommend that no more than 10 ml be injected into any one site. Any location where the skin is loose along the upper sides of the animal is suitable for administration. We prefer to give it 4 times per day (every 6 hours) at the rate of 20 ml per 10 pounds (10 cc per site). This is a case where more is NOT better since the kidneys may be unable to keep up with the amount administered. With a little practice and careful observation, you will become quite adept at arriving at the correct dosage. In some cases, the results will indeed be quite miraculous. [For the humorously inclined, you can create a squirting pincushion out of your darling little patient if you get enough liquid slushing around under the skin.] Tube feeding Tube feeding kits can be obtained from Pipestone; instruction for use are included with the kit. You can make your own by attaching a catheter to a regular syringe. Oral elctrolytes or milk can be fed in this manner. If the kid is strong enough to swallow in a normal manner, the tube can end on the back of the tongue if the situation is closely monitored. Regular tube feeding involves inserting a tube into the mouth and carefully passing it into the stomach. One should listen to the open end of the tube; if breathing sounds are heard, the tube should be withdrawn and re-insterted. If done properly, the only sounds, if any, will be of the digestive process. The syringe is then attached and filled with the desired amount of liquid while closing off the tube with the other hand until administration is desired. (If troubles occur, quickly remove the syringe from the tube, pinch off the tube and quickly withdraw it. Never withdraw the tube in such a manner that it can release liquid into the lungs as it is being withdrawn.) When you are ready, release a small amount of liquid to check the positioning of the tube. If there are no problems, the entire amount can then be released. It is helpful to have a partner refilling the syringe as needed until the whole amount has been given. Always keep a secure grip on the tube with one hand, since it is quite easy for the baby to swallow it...which is a genuine disaster! Floppy Kid Syndrome You can find a lot of non-functional links on the Internet about this mysterious disease. The "gist" of the matter is that it is a little-understood ailment which has acidosis as it's most distinctive clinical feature. Technically, I think it generally refers to a syndrome in which the kids appear fairly strong and normal at birth, but later turn into completely limp little "dishrags." The treatment is 1/2 tsp of baking soda given orally in cold water, according to reports citing Dr. Mary C. Smith of Cornell. And the good thing is that it's certainly worth a try since it can't do much harm if the diagnosis is wrong. Misc things to try as a stab in the dark Coffee - You didn’t read it here! Probios® - Contains microbes that help the digestive process Clostridium perfringens Type C&D antitoxin - usually for older babies Antibiotics LA200® - the antibiotic of choice for undiagnosed infections in baby animals Tylan® PenG - good choice if fever, but need to give every 8 - 12 hours Sulmet (can give w/ systemic PenG) - oral sulfa bolus Terramycin tablets Vitamin B Complex - Good for neurological problems, 1 ml every 1 or 2 days Many vets recommend SQ administration, but we prefer IM. Floppy Kid Syndrome You can find a lot of non-functional links on the Internet about this mysterious disease. The "gist" of the matter is that it is a little-understood ailment which has acidosis as it's most distinctive clinical feature. Technically, I think it generally refers to a syndrome in which the kids appear fairly strong and normal at birth, but later turn into completely limp little "dishrags." The treatment is 1/2 tsp of baking soda given orally in cold water, according to reports citing Dr. Mary C. Smith of Cornell. And the good thing is that it's certainly worth a try since it can't do much harm if the diagnosis is wrong. Misc things to try as a stab in the dark Coffee - You didn’t read it here! Probios® - Contains microbes that help the digestive process Clostridium perfringens Type C&D antitoxin - usually for older babies Antibiotics LA200® - the antibiotic of choice for undiagnosed infections in baby animals Tylan® PenG - good choice if fever, but need to give every 8 - 12 hours Sulmet (can give w/ systemic PenG) - oral sulfa bolus Terramycin tablets Vitamin B Complex - Good for neurological problems, 1 ml every 1 or 2 days Many vets recommend SQ administration, but we prefer IM. End of Quote from Website... I hope some of this helps you. Good Luck, Elaine | ||
| Brenda O'Dell Junior Member Username: brendaodell Post Number: 17 Registered: 08-2005 Posted From: 75.105.188.106 Rating: N/A |
Twins were born yesterday morning. The delivery was tough…I had to pull the first one and the 2nd one came out feet first – from the back end. They both are very weak…the nanny will not nurse. She was in a lot of pain after the delivery and her colostrum looks like custard. A friend milked her out today and gave me some colostrum that he had stored from one of his goats. The only problem is they won’t drink much. The buckling drank about 3 oz yesterday morning at 9:00. Since then he has had very little although I've tried a lot. He seems to get it in his nose and then has difficult breathing. His sucking ability is weak. He is peeing but not pooping. I tried stomach tubing but all he does is scream and I can't seem to get the tube deep enough. The second one -a doe - drank about 4 oz at the first feeding; since then she will drink about 1/2 oz each time I feed. She is peeing and pooping - black tarry. I tried tubing her as well and all she does is scream - it makes me think that the tube is going in the wrong direction. The first one, bucklin, weighs about 6 lbs and the does weighs about 4 lbs. Any suggestions...I'm concerned about them not getting enough noursihment and am at my wits end. I brought them into the house last night because it was so cold outside. |